Mary A. Wright and L.C. Wright Interview 1

L.C. WRIGHT: -- they came in to try to unionize Cannon. And, uh, they did get a 00:11:00union vote in there, but, uh, they went on strike, and Cannon hired people out of the mill --

(baby sneezes)

L.C. WRIGHT: -- for deputy sheriffs. And they put machine guns on the mill, and at the gates and things, to keep the union people out. And, uh, they just found them, just run them, slam out of town. Uh, and this has been put in the children's head all through these years, and -- and they just been anti-union. About 30% of them, you can count on being union people all the time, but, uh, the others are just afraid, and they've been raised, and they -- they've had what they call brainwashing all the years, that union was bad, outlaws and things. But they come in, take your money and run. And, uh, they just been against unions so long that it's been teached to their children. And even in 00:12:00the schools, they won't let them teach collective bargaining or anything.

STONEY: How have they used the history in the next campaign? You mentioned how they put pictures on the bulletin boards, etc., in the '70s.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah, we had a -- an election in '74. And, uh, they had enough of plywood for bulletin boards to build another planet there. They had all the pictures, the newspaper clippings with the pictures of machine guns at the gates, and at the buildings, and how they run the union off, and how the unions was trying to cause trouble and everything. Uh, oh, they just had them brainwashed good. It was all over the mill. You never seen so much plywood bulletin boards on the walls in the mill in your life. And, uh, they really fought them tooth and nail. And they do every time they come here. But, uh, 00:13:00the people really don't understand what's going on. Uh, the company gives the people more raises and more benefits when the union is active around them than any other time. When the people learn that, they say, "Well, we like it on the gate, but we don't want it in the plant."

STONEY: (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh, back in '74, they got more raises in '74 and '75, and never got in the history of the company, when the union was here. And more benefits.

STONEY: Could you go back and tell us about how they use those pictures? And you ended with a phrase that I want again. They don't want people to forget.

L.C. WRIGHT: No, they don't want people to forget. Uh, they even -- they won't even allow to teach them in school about the unions and collective bargaining and things. Uh, they'll go to the high schools -- in fact, used to, and would tell them that they didn't need a high school education, that 00:14:00they could come to work for Mr. Cannon. And, uh, they had all the mill houses and everything, and they was just a kept people. And, uh, they wasn't allowed to learn what the rest of the world was about. They never had a chance to learn. And now, they're so anti-union, it's hard to organize them anymore.

STONEY: Now, we -- we've been talking with a lot of people who keep talking about, well, it'd be great if we had Mr. Cannon back, and Mr. Cannon was so wonderful, and so forth. Where does all that come from?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, Mr. Cannon had over 1,600 houses in the mill village. And, uh, they paid anywhere from, uh, eight to $25 a month rent, and he owned the electrical company that they got the electricity from, and they paid less than half of what outside people has to pay for electricity, and the water bill was little or nothing. And, uh, any time that they didn't do like he wanted 00:15:00to, he'd make a move out of the house, and that was their livelihood. They had a pretty good living, as long as they lived in the millhouse, because everything was upkeep for them and all. And, uh, he kept a tight rein on the town, like if a man got drunk on Saturday night and got locked up, he'd get fired and have to move out of his home on Monday morning.

STONEY: Now, were you working in the mill?

L.C. WRIGHT: No, not all the time. I started in 1943. And, uh, I've seen Mr. Cannon several times, and, uh -- but, he was a nice man to talk to, and, uh, if he told you something, he'd usually stand by his word. Uh, he was a nice fella. It was a good place to work back in the '40s and '50s. But, uh, when the -- got up there and start selling them, and Murdock and Fieldcrest 00:16:00started buying them out and all, he just went berserk. (child cries) Uh, see, Mr. Cannon worked -- (continues crying)

CREW: You could talk about the baby and tell her to --

STONEY: Yeah. (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: You know, don't worry, you can take her if you think she'll stop crying in your arms.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh --

MARY A. WRIGHT: I think she's hungry. (inaudible) go feed her.

STONEY: Yeah.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mr. Cannon, uh, he -- he worked -- he -- he paid his own way as he w-- went. He -- he paid cash money for everything. Well, Mr. Murdock bought it and went in debt, and, uh, he operated with paper more or less. He had to show a big profit just to -- just to, uh, make the payment. (child cries, adult shushes). Well, Fieldcrest did the same way, now they're in debt so that they can't hardly make it. They sent us a paper where they had them pay 38 or $39 million, just in interest a year. And, well, Mr. Cannon, if he'd make 38 or 00:17:00$40 million, he was happy, because that was profit for him, because he -- he -- he's debt free.

STONEY: Now, what about the -- the wage -- uh, the salaries that these executives get here?

L.C. WRIGHT: (child cries) Oh, Lord. They -- they get good salaries. Um...

STONEY: Just about that.

L.C. WRIGHT: The executives, they -- they get g-- they've had good retirement all these years. But, uh, we only got retirement back in, uh, early '60s, I believe it was, when they started taking out on us. And, uh, then Mr. Murdock come in and got part of that, so we got a very little retirement.

STONEY: Now, di-- did -- did you work in the mill?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Twenty s-- twenty-eight years, [out front?]. I worked in the sheet department.

STONEY: And how did you find it working in the mill there?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Well, most of them -- I mean, you know, to start with, that was 00:18:00a good place to work. But, it -- the longer you was in there, oh, I mean, well, towards the end of the time that I was in there, it got kind of, like, hard to please him. You know? And --

STONEY: We've heard a lot about stretch-out. What did that mean?

MARY A. WRIGHT: That means making one do the job of two. Just cutting one job out and let, uh, one person run both of them.

STONEY: Did that happen often?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Not where I worked, it didn't.

STONEY: Uh-huh.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Because you can't run but one sewing machine at a time. (laughter)

STONEY: (laughter) I think [somebody there?] to get fed.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: Yeah, OK.

L.C. WRIGHT: (inaudible) tell him about the price of those fitted sheets when you first started to (inaudible).

MARY A. WRIGHT: Well, when they started off, the -- the fitted sheets, paid nine dollars and something a hundred. And our superintendent told him that it was a good job, it was good money, but it would be up to them to keep it that way. Well, some of them got greedy, and they started to -- you know, trying to see how many they could do. One time, I got on fitted sheets, it was three dollars and something a hundred. (laughter) That's how, uh, people can ruin a job, 00:19:00you know?

CREW: George?

GEORGE STONEY: Yeah?

CREW: B-- before we -- before we move, could you give us a little background? I mean, here you are, you were retired, you were all settled, and then this campaign came up last year, and you got all involved again. What happened?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, what really happened to me, I was retired. And, uh, when I retired, they didn't tell me anything about I wasn't getting no retirement. See, I'd worked for years, and paid into retirement and all.

CREW: (inaudible whispering)

L.C. WRIGHT: But then when I went to the retirement board, they told me they were put on hold, that I wouldn't get no retirement. And, uh, then, uh, I got in touch with the union, and they sent a man over here, and we got them investigating. And Mr. Murdock's -- took a retirement and sold Executive Life, and Executive Life went bankrupt. And, uh, Mr. Murdock took $36 million 00:20:00out of it and put it in his own pocket. And so we was left without any retirement. So we had a senate hearing, and the news media came in, and, uh, we raised enough a stink so Mr. Murdock come back and made up part of the retirement until the insurance companies in North Carolina could take over. And then, uh, we finally got where we can get our retirement, what little bit we got. Now, we -- we getting it now. But we had an awful time getting our retirement started.

STONEY: We've got to do that again. I think -- maybe we -- you'd better feed the baby.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Let me see.

STONEY: And I'm going to get --

MARY A. WRIGHT: I have to unplug this.

CREW: Andy, could you -- could you undo her?

CREW: Sure. (inaudible)

CREW: All we have to do is unplug [that thing?].

CREW: Just hold on to the -- hold on to the (inaudible).

STONEY: (inaudible) get him to tell that again. And --

CREW: Hey. All of the sudden you're quiet now, huh?

STONEY: Yeah, (inaudible) --

CREW: You can leave that on. That's OK.

00:21:00

CREW: Actually, I'll hold the kid and shoot, and then, uh, you can get this for a while.

STONEY: Uh, (inaudible). Just a moment, let me --

(overlapping dialogue; inaudible)

HELFAND: Yeah. Well, you just put that in your pocket.

STONEY: Hold it just a moment, Jamie. This is one for the union.

CREW: (inaudible)

CREW: He-- here, you pull focus, kid. I'm supposed to have an assistant on this job.

CREW: (laughter) (inaudible)

STONEY: Uh, could you tell us that story again, and, uh, in the -- when you're telling it, uh, tell us what the union had to do with that, if anything?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, when I went to retire, they didn't te-- say anything about I wasn't drawing in retirement. So, uh, I got in touch with the union after they told me they wasn't going to pay us no retirement. And so, uh, they got involved in it. And they got a man over here to talk to me. And we got to investigating, and -- and, uh, Mr. Murdock had sold our, uh, retirement fund to Executive Life, and they took out $36 million of it, and invested it for his own 00:22:00self. Well, uh, Executive Life went bankrupt, so there wasn't nothing for the rest of the people. So we got the news media, and union called in news reporters and things, and, uh, we got so hot on Mr. Murdock, he come back and made up on our retirement until the North Carolina Insurance Commissioner could get it straightened out. But now, we're getting our retirement like we're supposed to get it.

STONEY: Now, could you talk about, uh, what you've been -- you and other retired workers have been doing in this recent campaigns?

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah, we -- we work with the union to try to get the people to join the union. And, uh, to show them that, uh, they didn't have any guarantee of anything unless they had a union contract. Uh, it's just like, uh, they promised us for years that we'd have a supplement pay when we got old enough 00:23:00to retire to get our insurance with. But in '92, January '92, they cut that out. And there's nothing we can do about it, because we don't have a contract or anything. Uh, everybody that was supposed to get that supplement retirement this year don't get it. And the ones before, I think they still get it. But, uh, they can cut out anything they got anytime they want to, and there's nothing the workers can do about it, not until they wake up and get them a contract. If they don't get a contract, they won't never have nothing that they can count on.

STONEY: OK.

CREW: Cut.

(gap in audio)

CREW: You haven't forgotten how to do that now, have you?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Why --

CREW: George?

MARY A. WRIGHT: No, that comes natural.

(gap in audio)

CREW: Plug him in.

HELFAND: That would be real helpful one more time (inaudible).

STONEY: Mm-hmm. OK.

HELFAND: Um, and what he was doing in the mill when this campaign is going on, that they used those pictures.

STONEY: (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) OK. OK.

00:24:00

HELFAND: Because we don't really know much (overlapping dialogue; inaudible).

STONEY: OK. OK. Uh --

CREW: (inaudible) two shot, I'm going to move in when (inaudible).

STONEY: All right. Could you just tell us what you were doing in the mill when the campaign started? And --

CREW: In '74.

STONEY: In '74, because we -- we d-- kn-- know very little about that.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, I was fixing looms, and I was a loom fixer.

STONEY: J-- sorry, just start, "Well, in '74, when they started the last campaign, I was a loom fixer."

L.C. WRIGHT: In '74, when they started the last campaign, I was a loom fixer in number seven [weed room?]. And, uh, I got involved with the union, and, uh, went to union meetings. And, uh, when we got enough [accords?] to get an election, I got a lot of our observers -- observers out of the department that I worked in. I wasn't too popular right then, (inaudible) thing, but, uh, I was really -- was sold on the union, and it's -- I'm still sold on the union. I 00:25:00feel like the working people, it's the only protection they'll ever have is a union.

STONEY: Now, when you were in the union in '74 and they lost, uh, what happened to you?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, the day after the election, one of the vice presidents came to me, and he put his arm around me, and he said, "L.C.," he said, "I'm sorry the way things turned out." And then he said, "I want to tell you something." He said, "If anybody ever gives you any trouble or says anything to you whatsoever," he said, "You let me know," and said, "I'll straighten these people out." And I never did have no trouble after the election. Uh, one of the -- I wanted something done, I couldn't get something done. I'd say something to him, it wouldn't be but five minutes 00:26:00until things would be straightened out. Now, they were very nice to me after the election.

STONEY: Now, that was so different from what happened in '34 when they evicted a lot of people. What do you think the difference was?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, I think, um, the government had passed laws to protect people organizing and things that, uh, they didn't have before. Back then, the companies could just have the p-- their police force to come out and shoot them or whatever they wanted to do to the people that tried to organize the place. And they didn't have no laws and thi-- anything to protect the working man. And we're going to have to have some more laws passed to protect the working man, too, because this here administration, looks like it's trying to break all of our unions.

STONEY: Let me show you some pictures that we have from '34. You might be 00:27:00able to recognize some of them. Let's see here. This is, uh, right here. This is machine gun.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: Do you recognize the houses over there?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Is that in [Concord?]?

STONEY: That's in --

MARY A. WRIGHT: That the Gibson?

STONEY: Y-- that's right, that's the G--

MARY A. WRIGHT: Used to be the Old Gibson.

STONEY: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Yeah, I recognize the houses, because I was raised down in there.

STONEY: Uh-huh.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah, she'd recognize more than I will.

STONEY: You (inaudible)?

MARY A. WRIGHT: [I made bars?].

STONEY: Uh-huh. This was '34, and you see where they had the machine guns. So it wasn't just legend?

L.C. WRIGHT: No.

STONEY: This is reality?

L.C. WRIGHT: This is history.

STONEY: Yeah. Look at this. The --

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm. Where'd y'all get those pictures?

STONEY: They came from out of the archives.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Really?

STONEY: Isn't that amazing? That's -- reckon --

HELFAND: Is that the picture?

MARY A. WRIGHT: That used to be a boarding house for women.

L.C. WRIGHT: There used to be a boarding house up here.

MARY A. WRIGHT: No, it was for men and women, wasn't it?

STONEY: The -- mm-hmm.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Called it the Marilyn Hall, and Cannon owned that. They all -- that's been tore down.

00:28:00

STONEY: Now, the trick was that they -- they got s-- uh, home guards, national guardsmen --

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: -- from other places to come in here.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: They didn't get your old local people.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: Because a lot of textile workers were also national guardsmen.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

HELFAND: George, is that the picture that was used in '74?

STONEY: Yeah. Uh, now have we seen any pictures that we used in '74, do you think? Do you recognize any?

L.C. WRIGHT: No, they used all of them, I think.

STONEY: Uh-huh.

L.C. WRIGHT: Um, every one that I've seen, I've seen them on the bulletin board.

STONEY: Uh-huh. Yeah. That one, for example.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: What --

HELFAND: What would they do with that. Could we -- again, more specific?

STONEY: OK. Uh, what -- what do they do with them with -- when they put them on the bulletin board?

L.C. WRIGHT: Oh, it was the pictures. See, they had the newspaper's clippings and everything from back -- that day. And, uh, they had posted all on the bulletin board, and so everybody could read it.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they was down at our level, too, where you could see them.

STONEY: Uh-huh. (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh, they had them plastered all over the mill. I mean, there was about -- there was about 84 acres of floor space in there.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

00:29:00

L.C. WRIGHT: And you just think of the bulletin boards, they had just about wall-to-wall bulletin boards --

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- with those pictures on there.

STONEY: Well, now I've shown you the ones from -- from Kannapolis. Here are some others that -- from other places. This is in South Carolina. You see, where the -- the guards are out with their -- their guns.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: See the pistol there.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: And here's one that they've got. See with the bayonets up?

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: Isn't that amazing?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: And then here is the saddest one of all, to me. People going back to work with the na-- the guardsmen there.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: They look pretty whipped, don't there?

MARY A. WRIGHT: (inaudible)

L.C. WRIGHT: Now that -- that's what you call a police state there, when --

STONEY: Yeah. Uh-huh.

L.C. WRIGHT: And we're talking about freedom.

STONEY: Mm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And when we lose our unions, we're going to lose our freedom, 00:30:00too. Uh, there's no two ways about it. Uh, every country in history, just about it, when they lose their unions, they're taken over by dictators, or --

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- or something like that there.

STONEY: Now, here's another picture that they used a lot. Tear gas.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: And so people think that unions equal strikes --

MARY A. WRIGHT: Telephone.

STONEY: -- equals violence.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: And that, of course, was the problem.

L.C. WRIGHT: But, you know, it's kind of like Jimmy Hoffa.

MARY A. WRIGHT: L.C., the telephone a-ringing.

L.C. WRIGHT: I can't get away right now.

HELFAND: OK. I'll get it.

MARY A. WRIGHT: OK.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, you know, I read a book on Jimmy Hoffa --

MARY A. WRIGHT: That might be right.

L.C. WRIGHT: Where they companies would hire the police and company guards to come out and shoot the truck drivers down and everything else.

STONEY: Yeah.

L.C. WRIGHT: And he had to get the mob to come in there to kind of even the score up.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: But I talked to many a truck driver, and people talk about him being crooked. He said that they didn't care how crooked he was. They always 00:31:00delivered to them.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh, they would laugh at you when you're talking about Jimmy Hoffa being crooked, because, uh, he got them everything they wanted.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh --

STONEY: Well, here's, uh, the kind of picture that, uh, I don't imagine you did see.

L.C. WRIGHT: All right.

STONEY: This is a big Labor Day parade in Gastonia.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Hmm.

STONEY: That was in seventy f-- in, uh, '34. It was interesting, we were s-- showing them down in Kannapolis -- um, in Gastonia.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: And people couldn't believe that that many people came out then. We found a fella who played the drums, uh, that day.

MARY A. WRIGHT: (laughter)

STONEY: And we've got movie footage of this. And a fella found his father in the parade.

L.C. WRIGHT: That's great.

STONEY: Yeah, yeah.

L.C. WRIGHT: I don't know any of them.

STONEY: Yeah. Now here's something you didn't see. Uh --

00:32:00

MARY A. WRIGHT: Where is that?

STONEY: Uh, this is, uh, in front of the Parkdale Mill down in Gastonia.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Oh.

STONEY: Uh...

L.C. WRIGHT: I read about it, well --

STONEY: Yeah. Well, this is one of the big organizers, uh, Albert Hinson.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: Making a speech there. We have this in movies as well. But this is the thing that startles everybody. That was a Labor Day parade, and look at all those locals represented.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm.

STONEY: Wouldn't it be great to see that, [Benny?]?

L.C. WRIGHT: Oh, Lord, wouldn't it, though? Well, that's what it's going to take, the people going to have to get up and take this country back.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they going to have to take their unions back to ever get anything for themselves, because they're robbing the working man to death now. There's more people in poverty now than there was 20 years ago.

STONEY: Mm-hmm. That's right. Yeah.

00:33:00

L.C. WRIGHT: And until we do get the people educated in what's going on, they're going to take everything they got.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they going to take everything they got.

STONEY: Mm-hmm. Hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they going to send the job to Mexico, looks like.

STONEY: Mm-hmm. So we're talking about her future.

L.C. WRIGHT: That's right.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: She doesn't look concerned right now. (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: It does. It -- it scares me what --

MARY A. WRIGHT: I don't believe it's entered her mind yet. (laughter)

STONEY: (laughter) Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Yes.

L.C. WRIGHT: It scares me what the young people is coming up into now.

MARY A. WRIGHT: (inaudible) I got a while to go.

STONEY: Yeah. I d-- I know. Yeah.

L.C. WRIGHT: You think, when you and I came up, uh --

MARY A. WRIGHT: Oh.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- the job market was pretty well wide open.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Tell him to quiet that car down.

L.C. WRIGHT: There was a future there. But today, even with a college education --

STONEY: Mm-hmm. Hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- you don't have, um, no guarantee of nothing.

STONEY: No. That's true. Well, uh, as -- I teach at New York University, and I'm very much worried about the kind of society my students are moving out into.

L.C. WRIGHT: It is a scary situation right now.

STONEY: Uh-huh.

L.C. WRIGHT: Especially for the young people.

00:34:00

MARY A. WRIGHT: Is that all you had of Kannapolis? And Concord?

STONEY: That's all I have of Ka-- Kannapolis and Concord. This down -- is down in Loray again. And we found a match shot for this. (laughter) Uh, the -- we talked with a fella whose father was one of the -- the dirty one hundreds.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: UH, this is, uh -- this is in Belmont, where one of the soldiers got gunsh-- uh, happy and stabbed a --

MARY A. WRIGHT: (laughter) Running, aren't they?

STONEY: -- stabbed somebody and killed him. But here's, again, the kind of pictures that they didn't put up. This at a big l-- uh, labor rally.

L.C. WRIGHT: Hmm.

STONEY: See that?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, there are still people in Fieldcrest-Cannon who are out now who will still brag about their fathers and things being in this to help run the union out of town.

STONEY: Ah.

00:35:00

L.C. WRIGHT: And s-- I know one feller, still had his badge that his daddy wore, deputy sheriff, deputy sheriff up there to help keep the union out of Cannon back then.

STONEY: Hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they thought that was the grandest thing ever happened.

STONEY: (laughter) Hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: They didn't know they were cutting their own throats for a generation.

STONEY: Why do you think that they didn't realize that?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, they didn't know. They wasn't educated, they had never been exposed to unions, and now, the companies had them brainwashed. The companies run the schools. And, uh, they just don't know. They don't understand how they work. Uh, union organizers come in, they'll put up 3 or $4 million on a big old wire box and come down through there and say, "This is your union dues. It's going out of town. What good is it going to do you?" 00:36:00You know? Everything about a union that, uh, they think can turn around, make it look bad. That's what they do to the people. And they got the people scared to death of a union.

STONEY: Mm.

L.C. WRIGHT: But about 30% of the people has woken up. You can just about count on about 30% of them at any given time. But the other 60% is really going to have to be educated if there's a possibility of that. I don't know whether the possibility of educating or not, seemed like textile people have, uh, got the idea, or somebody else will give it to them, that somebody's going to throw it in their lap, and they're not going to -- have to do nothing for it.

STONEY: Well, we've heard from, uh, a lot of the executives we've interviewed, that Southern people are independent and just don't want unions. Which, mm, to you, may seem a contradiction in terms, but that's the way they 00:37:00put it.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, they are independent, but I think a little of it is because the lack of education.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, the majority of the people that's been in textile for years was undereducated. You'd be surprised at the ones in the -- in textile that couldn't read and write.

STONEY: Mm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And they only knew what the boss man told them. And, uh, those people, you can't tell nothing else, because the company tells them that, and that's all they'll listen to.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Until people gets more, if they're willing to read and watch the -- uh, rest of the world and learn, they won't never be no better off.

STONEY: Now, what gave you the -- a different vision? What gave you a different idea?

CREW: Can we pick that up again? I think we got the car on top.

00:38:00

STONEY: Yeah. Uh, what gave you a different idea? Why do you have a different view of unions from other people in the plant?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, I've watched people, and I noticed -- studied people from the -- up North, where they had unions. And I've studied their wages and their living conditions. And all union people had a better standard of living than non-union people did. And, uh, then when the union came, I went to their meetings. I even went to the steward school. And I studied the unions. And I -- I reckon, uh, uh, just trying to kindly educated myself on them, you know, more than anything else. Because it wasn't taught in the public schools here.

STONEY: And you came from -- you were born here?

L.C. WRIGHT: No, I was born down in Anson County, uh, a county that's more anti-union than this one is. (laughter)

00:39:00

STONEY: (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, that's the truth. Uh...

STONEY: So you didn't come from a union background?

L.C. WRIGHT: No. But, uh, I always wished that we could get organized, and more people could have something that they could count on, uh, so that when a man tells you something, they can't just come up and say, "Well, I'm not going to do it." If you have a contract with somebody, uh, it's a lot better than somebody telling you something, and then he'll say, "Well, I didn't say it" or something.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, if you got it in writing, you can read it. You got it. Just hearsay, you can't prove it.

STONEY: Mm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And so there's not much law in backing a man up for what he says if he ain't got it on paper.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh, I feel like the people in this county and all the rest of 00:40:00North Carolina is going to have to unionize before the standard of living ever comes up, because it's been one of the lowest paid states in the union for so many years. And, uh, the company's not going to bring it up here. They bringing companies down here from up north for cheap labor. They said, "Come on down here," the politician does. Says, "I'll give you a man that's [why I bought?] labor cheaper and you can get one man up north." And they bringing it in here, and the people don't understand that if they don't raise their standard of living, they're better off without them, because they're ruining our environment, our waters, they're polluting everything for our children. We had a beautiful state, but they're going to ruin it looking for cheap labor.

STONEY: Uh, what -- where did your union background come from?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Uh, I didn't have any either. I was like him. You know, I just learned of it when I went to work in the -- in '74. But I wasn't even 00:41:00on the payroll at that time. They -- they wrote and told me to come in and vote. (laughter)

STONEY: (laughter) The company did?

MARY A. WRIGHT: (laughter) I went. (laughter) They didn't know how I was going to vote.

CREW: So they figured since --

MARY A. WRIGHT: Uh, they wasn't --

CREW: -- you're retired, they asked you to come in and (inaudible)?

MARY A. WRIGHT: I wasn't retired, I just wasn't working at that time.

CREW: OK.

GEORGE STONEY: Uh-huh.

MARY A. WRIGHT: I was out --

GEORGE STONEY: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: -- for surgery, or something.

GEORGE STONEY: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: They'd have knew how I was going to voted, they wouldn't have (laughter) bothered to --

GEORGE STONEY: Yeah.

MARY A. WRIGHT: -- have notified me.

STONEY: So you don't know where your union background came from?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm-mm. I sure don't. I should have remembered that big strike in -- in the Concord, because I was seven years old, but I don't remember it. And my mother always worked down there at Gibson Mill, my daddy. But I -- I don't recollect any of that.

STONEY: Do you remember a fella named Red Lisk?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Mm-mm. No, I don't.

STONEY: Uh-huh. We've been kind of chasing down his memory because we're 00:42:00trying to -- to say to present day textile workers that there's some people in their past who should be honored as well as the people who invented the textile, uh, machinery, and who, uh, put up the mills. Should --

L.C. WRIGHT: That's true.

STONEY: And have you been down to the c-- uh, the museum in Kannapolis?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Yeah, we've been there.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah, we've been down there, to the visiting center. That what they call them?

STONEY: Did you see any, uh, tributes to workers?

L.C. WRIGHT: No.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Penny, Penny.

L.C. WRIGHT: Penny, hush. Uh, you take some of those people back in the early '20s and the late '20s, now, that was your heroes.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Them people had their life in their own hand, when, uh, they sacrificed, try to organize these people. And these people turned against them 00:43:00like that there, that -- that's your real, uh, heroes there.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, the people nowadays, uh, they don't have to be a hero. All they have to use is common sense. Uh, they talk about all the rains, and all being so mean and everything. Well, he get paid for being mean. But, uh, the people can be just as mean as he can if they want a union.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And that's what they going to have to do --

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- is be willing to stand up and sacrifice just a little bit. Those people were sacrificing their lives for a better life.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: But these people is even scared to death to even vote in a private election.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: They scared somewhat into how they voted. But, uh, I'm a --

STONEY: Who is Ozzie Raines? Tell me about him.

L.C. WRIGHT: Oh, he's the spokesperson for Fieldcrest-Cannon [up here?].

STONEY: I see.

00:44:00

L.C. WRIGHT: He's the one that gives all these scary movie talks and things against the union, and the one that's testifying in court about all of them, you know, not -- no discrimination, and, uh, like, they got a fair election and all. He's the hatchet man.

STONEY: I see. Did you see any of those movies?

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah. I saw some of them. Uh, [Bonnie?] brought me one over here, a month or so ago, I looked at it on VCR.

STONEY: What did it look like?

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, it's about the same thing as it was, uh, 20 years ago. (laughter)

STONEY: (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: Same old stories. Uh, and, uh, you would have to start from scratch to bargaining, and they didn't have to do nothing but bargain in good faith. Uh, they did take everything, you'd have to strike. And -- and what it would be like, people striking in the union, people cutting your tires and busting out your windshields and things. 00:45:00Everything bad about a union --

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: -- that could happen. That's what they show. Uh, it's just more or less to brainwash the people against the union.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And to scare them. It's a scare tactic. It's all it is. And, uh, let them -- they let them know that they're the one that pays their salary, and they get a union, they going to have to fight for every bit of pay they get them.

STONEY: Well, it hasn't changed since the early '20s. We were talking with some fellas the other day whose, uh, parents had to leave, uh, the mills.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: And, uh, go all the way to South Carolina to find a job. That was in the early '20s.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: So it's been pretty much the same thing since.

L.C. WRIGHT: It hasn't improved very much.

STONEY: I'm afraid not.

L.C. WRIGHT: Just like the labor laws. We need some labor laws that'll 00:46:00strengthen these laws up enough so these companies can't keep just breaking them and getting them slapped on the wrist, and turn right around and break them again.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, it -- uh, elected officials ain't well into passing laws to get the working man some room to bargain, he's going to be in poverty as long as he lives in this country.

JAMIE STONEY: Do you think there's a direct connection between companies and the banks i-- in what could be considered a union or co-- a company town?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, I think, uh, the whole government that we've had for the last 12 years has been out to destroy our unions. Uh, the administration. I think it started when Reagan fired the -- the air controllers. And the companies really found out they can 00:47:00 break the unions in any way they could.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: And, uh, I really believe that's been the downfall ever since. And now, the people is getting the one, and, well, the union don't have any strength. And I think we going to have to have some legislation passed to put some teeth in these laws before our union can have some strength again. Uh --

JAMIE STONEY: Explain what you mean by teeth.

L.C. WRIGHT: What?

JAMIE STONEY: [Well?], explain what you mean by teeth and the laws.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, uh, you take a -- in this last election, they got 150-something, or 60-something, violations against Fieldcrest-Cannon.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, Fieldcrest-Cannon don't care how much they break the law, uh, as long as they can beat the union.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: They'll go out here and pay a little fine or something, and they'll appeal this thing, uh, four or five years until people say, "Well, that union can't do nothing for us." And, uh, the laws is made for a -- as 00:48:00long as you find a man, just a token of what it should be, he going to break the laws, any time, uh, he can come out breaking the law and come out ahead of the game, he going to break the law. That's exactly what it is. They going to have to put some teeth in that law, or when they break it, they can't come out ahead of it. They -- it's going to cost them.

HELFAND: Yeah. You know what, George? Can we try something else?

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

HELFAND: Can you get up? Can we --

STONEY: Yeah, sure. Well, uh, these -- these are some other pictures here. This -- uh, this is where the union was, uh, giving people food back in '34.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Is that in Concord?

STONEY: This is in -- in c-- uh, in Belmont.

MARY A. WRIGHT: Oh.

STONEY: And then I'll show you one in Charlotte, uh, where they were doing that. These are all organization things. Uh, yeah, here. Take a look at that. 00:49:00And so the union feeding, uh, people were pretty desperate.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: People were pretty desperate, and that was, uh, the union feeding them. They didn't have much to feed them with.

L.C. WRIGHT: That's right.

STONEY: But we were talking with a woman today who told us that after the strike, people from the North sent down clothing, and she showed us a picture of her son, that got a coat, that --

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: -- that they sent. Well, you f-- um, see what that is. They're padding, taking people down.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: Uh, how much violence was there in '74?

MARY A. WRIGHT: Oh, there wasn't any.

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, I didn't hear tell of any, to tell you the truth.

STONEY: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, it went off awful smooth in '74. We had a few, uh, challenged votes, but --

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

00:50:00

L.C. WRIGHT: -- um, it wasn't like it was this time. Uh, seem like it gets rougher every -- every time.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, the company gets meaner and rougher, and break the law more every time.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, you take Fieldcrest up here, the way they've been doing business, uh, it's just like they re-- promised this r-- these retirees a supplement pay. Well, they give it to them for four or five years, and now, in '92, in January '92, they cut it all out. They said, we just not going to pay it anymore. And so what resource has a retiree got against that company to make them live up to their promise? Uh, they can break promises going and a-coming, and there's nothing you can do about it.

00:51:00

STONEY: Well, we were going around town, taking some pictures, and this gentleman came up, kind of dressed like a retiree. And he's asked me what we were doing, and I told him, a-- and he said, well, he'd been, uh, born and brought up here. He left because he couldn't stand to work in -- in the cotton mill.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: He went north, he got a job in, uh -- as a machinist in the North. He had -- was g-- joined a union, worked as a union man all his working life. He came back here to retire. And he's got a nice house, we went out to see it, out next to the golf course. He plays golf almost every day.

L.C. WRIGHT: Yeah.

STONEY: And I said, "Well, now, how do you feel about this campaign now to get a union?" He says, "Oh, they should -- they should drop it." I said, "Why?" He says, "It's going to split this town apart."

L.C. WRIGHT: (laughter)

00:52:00

STONEY: It's -- here's a guy who's had a good union experience all his life.

L.C. WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

STONEY: But w-- as soon as he gets back here, he says that it's going to split the town apart.

MARY A. WRIGHT: They don't need it here. (laughter)

STONEY: That --

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, that's just like it was when Philip Morris moved down here. Uh, you take all the people that was anti-union in Cannon, fought it tooth and nail, quick as they could, got an offer for a job in Philip Morris, they took it.

MARY A. WRIGHT: (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: They run. "Well, we thought you didn't like union, because Philip Morris was union." They said, "Oh, well, that's a good union down there. We like it down there."

STONEY: (laughter)

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, but Cannon Mill ain't supposed to have a union.

STONEY: I see. Yeah.

HELFAND: Why not?

L.C. WRIGHT: Well, I've had a lot of people tell me, make some remarks that you wouldn't believe about the union. I've had them to tell me that if it wasn't for that certain union organizer, I'd join the union. And they'd 00:53:00tell me if, uh, this was the AFL-CIO, I'd join the union. (laughter)

MARY A. WRIGHT: They just don't like the textile union, (laughter) some reason.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, but, uh, they just don't like the textile union, they say. Uh...

STONEY: Do you think that race has anything to do with it?

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, I think the companies -- plays the race issue. Uh, I really believe the races would get along good if the company didn't pit them against each other. Uh, they all get the rumors started before an election that the blacks is going to take over. The blacks is going to tell you what to do, and they going to do this, and they going to do that. Well, the first thing you know, they got the white people, say, "Well, we don't want them people 00:54:00telling us nothing," so then they go to the companies. Uh, I mean, it's just one big game with them. Uh, for the people, would be put together and live for a fair, unbiased election, they wouldn't have no race problem at all. In other words, I think the blacks and whites would get along fine if the companies didn't try to turn them against each other.

STONEY: Well, we were certainly impressed with the way the blacks and the whites were working together in the union, as we saw it here.

L.C. WRIGHT: Uh, I don't think they would have any problem at all. Some of the best people I know are, uh, black in their union. And, uh, it's the companies that plays the race issue. They want to keep it that a-way.

STONEY: Mm.

L.C. WRIGHT: They don't want the blacks and the whites getting along, because 00:55:00they're scared they'll unionize. Uh, it's just like, uh, talking about welfare and stuff. The first thing you hear about blacks, that they all on welfare. Well, there's more white people on welfare than there are black people. I don't see how they get that. But if you don't give the black people nothing, the white -- poor white people ain't going to get nothing either.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Because if you can't raise the black people's standard of living up, the poor white people's going to stay right down there with them.

STONEY: Mm-hmm.

L.C. WRIGHT: Because they all going to have to make the move together to ever get anywhere. Uh, but these companies and things, they want to keep this thing a racial issue. They don't want our standard of living to come up. They would rather buy their jet planes and things and party and let us live in poverty, fight among ourselves. But, uh, I really don't think we'd have no racial problems if, uh, the companies would quit pitting each other against each 00:56:00other, propaganda, I suppose.

STONEY: OK.

HELFAND: Yeah. You know what would be really nice, (inaudible) come this way.

STONEY: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

CREW: You were showing pictures. It was really --

00:57:00

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00:58:00

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