ETTA MAE ZIMMERMAN: -- parked when he got home. He didn't have --
JUDITH HELFAND: OK, I want you to tell me, before -- you've been very -- and
you've been very strong every time I've seen you that Roosevelt called the national strike, is that right? Can you talk about Roosevelt and his relationship to the nation-wide strike, OK?ZIMMERMAN: Well, I couldn't say for sure that he called it but --
GEORGE STONEY: All right, now, always say –
(break in video)
ZIMMERMAN: I can't say that Roosevelt called the strike but it was a national
strike and they wanted it throughout the land as [postman?] national and any -- I got some papers out there and I'm pretty sure it tells the whole story. But when I told it out at the house that night, Roger and [Renda?] both said, 00:01:00"No." Well, they all wasn't even there. Of course, I know Roger's got a good education. Renda probably a little bitty boy but it was a national strike as opposed to being everywhere.HELFAND: Did you hear about what was going on in other places? Were you in
contact? Tell me what you knew about what was going on and how you felt about it.ZIMMERMAN: I didn't know about other places. I just tryin' (laughter) to --
go to the ones around us. Papa kept up with it. Other places and politics but – (break in video)HELFAND: OK. Etta Mae, OK, as clearly as you can and as compact as you can,
describe to me why how after the strike Homer went to LaGrange and what he was doing, OK? That's exactly what he -- what I need to understand and why he was 00:02:00doing it, OK?ZIMMERMAN: Well, all I knows is they having trouble and there and then he went --
HELFAND: OK, start, after the strike.
ZIMMERMAN: After the strike when Lee Owen was staying with us, Homer went down
there to help out because they was having trouble.HELFAND: OK, you know what, I need to know that he went to LaGrange. I need to
know that after the strike Homer -- try it again.ZIMMERMAN: After the strike -- after we quit having local meetings, Homer went
to LaGrange to help out down there because they were having trouble. They were goin' to throw the people out of the houses, and as far as I know, they did. But I don't know what Homer done after he left Hogansville and went to Montgomery. 00:03:00HELFAND: Very good, thank you. And, now, were those people they were throwing
out of the houses union people? Is that why?ZIMMERMAN: That's why they was throwing 'em out.
HEGLAND: OK. Why don't you tell me that, OK?
ZIMMERMAN: Callaway on the mills. And I -- if I'm not badly mistaken -- now,
I read where he put a union snap -- you know there's one of his -- one of the Callaways run for vice president one time.HELFAND: OK, I want you tell that story one more time and say Callaways owned
the mill and they were throwing the union people out of the houses so Homer left Hogansville and went over there to try to help these people who were being evicted. Can you try that? Try it.ZIMMERMAN: Callaway owned the mills and Homer [Webst?] went down there to help
00:04:00because the people were having trouble about joining the union. Some of 'em joined, some of 'em didn't but ones that was joining they was threatening to throw 'em out of the houses, and as far as I know, they did.GEORGE STONEY: Good.
HEFLAND: Great. OK.
ZIMMERMAN: Homer said there's one place where they was going to a funeral, and
they'd give 'em time to go to that funeral and get back.HEFLAND: OK.
ZIMMERMAN: I don't know for sure, Judy, why they was throwing 'em out of the
houses. As far as I know, it's because they joined the union.HEFLAND: But they didn't do that in Hogansville.
ZIMMERMAN: Uh-huh.
HEFLAND: Now, could we talk a little bit -- I want to talk a little bit --
(break in video)
00:05:00ZIMMERMAN: I said I don't know why people is ashamed of joining the union but --
HEFLAND: OK, I'm going to ask you to start again --
ZIMMERMAN: -- I know a few people that --
HEFLAND: -- and don't do that.
ZIMMERMAN: -- it must be.
HEFLAND: OK, can you start again and say I don't -- if you want to say I
don't know why people don't want to talk about it, why they'd be ashamed to join the union and then talk about yourself and your attitude towards history and don't touch the table like that. OK?ZIMMERMAN: I don't know why anybody'd be ashamed joining. I don't know
why they'd be ashamed of what went on while they were members of the union because we joined it to better things instead of -- that's what it was all about was to make things better. I always -- when I was in school I liked 00:06:00history. I like to read about things that happened a long time ago.GEORGE STONEY: Do you think it's important for young people to know what
happened here?ZIMMERMAN: I don't know why it would hurt 'em.
HEFLAND: OK. Can you talk about that? Here in Hogansville, talk about Hogansville.
ZIMMERMAN: Well, everybody in Hogansville is -- if they're not dead and they
still live here know about us going to Atlanta and they know why. Miss [Trussle?] never did get through teasing Papa about voting for Eugene Talmadge. She tried her best to tell him and that's the night was still lives at. I said Bakers live there but Miss Trussle had moved there, and she told Papa when he went to [Young?] to listen to him. She said you can't believe a word that 00:07:00man says, and then she never did get through teasing him about voting for him. Papa voted for Hoover too. But as far as I know, that's the only time.GEORGE STONEY: OK, now the last thing we want to talk about is the old
acquaintance reunion.HEFLAND: Yeah, OK, tell --
GEORGE STONEY: And mention the old --
(break in video)
ZIMMERMAN: -- years before it was organized --
HEFLAND: OK, you got to mention old acquaintance reunion (overlapping dialogue; inaudible).
ZIMMERMAN: Four years before the old acquaintance reunion was organized, Mr.
Bill [Damrin?] got shot in the stomach. It killed him. We -- we were with -- I was with some friends over at Mr. Damrin's house when the sheriff come. They wanted us to go out of the room so as they could talk to his wife and family. 00:08:00And when we went out there was eight of us on the back porch -- eight -- eight people that had lived at East Newnan. And I just looked around and I said, "Well goodness knows, it look like East Newnan's down here tonight." (inaudible) -- JP [Hearst?] said, "Yeah, and that's the only time we get together when somebody dies." I said, "Well, why don't we have an East Newnan reunion sometime." He said, "OK, who's going to start it?" I said, "You start it." You know, just teasing. That was before -- that was four years before. But Harry [Button?] told me the year his daddy died he said, 00:09:00"I've heard you mention that over and over. You gonna have an old acq-- East Newnan reunion. Why don't you do it and quit talking about it?" I said, "Well, I can't do it by myself." But my brother lived in Newnan and I'd go down to Miss Malcolm's and use her telephone. Austin didn't have a telephone. I'd go down to Miss Malcolm's and call -- if I didn't talk too long, I'd get to call four people but I'd called about 10, 11. When Lucille Cassoway come spent the night with me and we was looking over a East Newnan reun-- East Newnan picture that was made in 1917 at the school house, and she said, "Etta Mae, why don't we have that reunion?" I said, "I'm trying 00:10:00to make up one now." But I called [Rosalie Cranston?] asked her how would she like to be invited to an East Newnan reunion. She said, "Etta Mae, you know I was married when I was 16 years old, and I stayed away five years. I doubt what I know a third of 'ems names or not, let alone knows them." I said, "OK, I've got a theme paper full of names that lived at East Newnan when you did, and I know where I got a theme paper full and I know where they are." I said, "You want me to call 'em all on the telephone?" And she said, "Yeah." So I called 'em all. She remembered. But when I'd call one person, I'd have them to call their family and then I told her, I said "There's more of 'em 00:11:00here in Hogansville than anywhere else." I called off a page full, Leo [Geonovim] and she knowed them. So Rosalie and Lucille Cassoway, and Harry Barton helped to make up that old acquaintance reunion after I'd done called a few people, and I didn't do it by myself. And then -- I don't know, about the fourth reunion Leona had to go to writing it up because I'd lost the sight of my eyes.HELFAND: Now how many reunions have you had? Can you tell me --
ZIMMERMAN: Twenty-six.
HELFAND: OK, start with --
ZIMMERMAN: But I've got 25 -- 21 in that book.
HELFAND: OK. Clearly, say, we wanted to have these reunions. This is what we
00:12:00do. I need a (break in video) it's a beautiful story and we're going to be able to use lots of parts --(break in video)
ZIMMERMAN: I'll just say -- about four friends in Hogansville called around
making up an East Newnan reunion from looking at a school picture. And I finally named it "Old Acquaintance Reunion." I didn't like the name of it but it stuck. We've had 24 -- I mean we had 21 here in Hogansville and we've had 6 at Sharpsburg. And I keep getting some new ones.HELFAND: Do all those folks know that you were interned at Fort McPherson and
that you believe in the union and all of that? Can you talk about that? Who all these folks are? 00:13:00ZIMMERMAN: I don't know as we've ever talked about it but I'm pretty sure
they know it.HELFAND: Start that sentence again, tell me.
ZIMMERMAN: I said I don't know as all these friends know about it but I'm
pretty sure they've heard it.GEORGE STONEY: Now, finally, look at Judy and tell us, how do you feel looking
back 57 years later about seeing yourself in that newsreel we brought around. Do you feel proud, do you feel ashamed, tell Judy how you feel.ZIMMERMAN: Well --
GEORGE STONEY: Look right at Judy.
ZIMMERMAN: -- I know how I felt at the time.
GEORGE STONEY: OK.
HELFAND: Look at me, look at me.
ZIMMERMAN: And it didn't bother me.
HELFAND: Start from the top.
ZIMMERMAN: How do I start, 57 years ago?
GEORGE STONEY: Yeah.
ZIMMERMAN: Fifty-seven years ago when I went to Fort McPherson, I wasn't
ashamed of a thing and I'm not ashamed of it now. It's the best I can describe it. I wouldn't care for any of the friends that meet us every year 00:14:00knowed it, 'cause I didn't do nothing that was so terrible, other than except join the union. Some of 'em be afraid -- mention union to 'em, yeah, I guess, but I wouldn't be. I don't know as they ever had that vote at the mill, but I told there be a [Martin?] I said if I was to vote at all, I'd vote yes, and you know it. He was -- he was my overseer.GEORGE STONEY: Now, you said something right to Judy the other day. She said,
you said, well, I was -- I was joining the union because I was proud of (break in video) --HELFAND: A lot of people don't believe that, a lot (break in video) --
GEORGE STONEY: (inaudible)
00:15:00HELFAND: What do you want to start with, I'm proud?
GEORGE STONEY: OK.
HELFAND: OK, Etta Mae, do it.
ZIMMERMAN: Well, I'm not ashamed of being there. I mean -- being a member of
the union and join -- and going to Fort McPherson 'cause I was fighting for something I believed in. I still believe in the union. But a lot of people don't. As far as I know, they don't even have one in Columbus or Charleston where Leona's son's president. Nationally, they don't want a union but I've got a nephew in California that's head of their local. He goes to Florida every year on business. But he's not ashamed of it 'cause the letters across his jacket in big letters. He's -- tells a lot (break in 00:16:00video) --HELFAND: OK.
JAMIE STONEY: And now --
HELFAND: OK, 30 seconds --
CREW: This is room tone for the last two interviews. OK. (Break in audio) OK.
We're (inaudible) selected sound here. Can you keep rolling? This kept happening.ZIMMERMAN: Judy, we're having a --
JAMIE STONEY: Yeah, just rolling (inaudible).
ZIMMERMAN: -- (inaudible) reunion now. (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) (faint
background conversation) (break in audio) 00:17:00[Silence]
00:18:00[Silence]
HELFAND: -- start.
JAMIE STONEY: Just a second, OK.
THOM MALCOM: I've been talking to Ma a lot lately about when she worked in the
mill when she was younger and all, you know, and she'd been really telling me some great stories, you know, I really been loving talk to her. You know how I know if they're [Belinda?] and all, you know, Belinda's Katie's stepmom and I'm her step daddy.F1: Yes.
MALCOM: Well all them got to be like family ain't we?
F1: Yes.
MALCOM: Do you, do you have a picture of her when she was younger?
F1: Oh, yes.
MALCOM: I sure would love to see that. She was a beautiful little girl. She
00:19:00looked like a little girl there.F1: She was.
MALCOM: Could you tell me some about like how it was to -- when y'all were
growing up and --HELFAND: You know, uh, let's just –
(break in video)
F1: -- was 14 years old. She -- they had a hard time and, uh, they had to farm
and kids back then didn't get to school like children do today, and so she said she could make more selling wood than she could to go to school so they started building the [Pepperell?] Village. So mother when she was 14 years old, she had a horse and a little wagon.MALCOM: No, she didn't.
F1: Yeah, and she'd go down and she'd pay the man 25 cents a load for the
wood and then she would sell it for a dollar a load. And she could make more selling wood than my grandmother did working in the mill.MALCOM: Selling wood more than --
F1: Uh-huh, because my grandmother didn't make but about a dollar and a half
or maybe 2 dollars and 50 cents a week back then.MALCOM: You're kidding me.
00:20:00F1: And I tell, back then children they had a hard time making a living. And --
so it was something real cute let me tell y'all about.MALCOM: All right. I'd love to hear it.
F1: Well, she went to work in the mill, this truant officer from the school --
well, they had watched for her, Mr. Vivian [Hollis?] would watch for her and when he'd come through they'd put mother down in a big old barrel and put a lid on her. And they had -- and they had hide her. Well, when he'd leave then they'd take her back out and put momma back to work.MALCOM: Send her right back to her job.
F1: Yeah, and she -- what she was doing back then it was old time. They don't
do it now but they was making what you called these bobbins, like back winding. Well, that's what mother did. She was a back winder back then, and so then she decided she'd start selling wood so she worked in the mill and she sold wood too.MALCOM: She sure worked hard when she was young, didn't she?
F1: She worked -- yeah, and then she got married and she left from here and she
00:21:00went to the Valley. She lived in Lynette.MALCOM: Lynette.
F1: Yeah, and she worked up there for about 11 years and she was an automatic
[spooler?] woman. Well, when they first put the spoolers in -- the Barber Coleman Company put 'em in --HELFAND: OK, that's great. You know what (tape cuts out).
F1: Here we go again.
HELFAND: OK, now, but you don't have to start with that whole story.
MALCOM: Just say --
HELFAND: You could say, now let me show you a picture of my momma when she was
14. Now is that when she went in to go to work at --(break in video)
F1: The picture, my mother, when she was 14 years old when she went to work in
the mill.MALCOM: I'd sure love to see that.
F1: Now this is my mom. This is --
MALCOM: This is when she first -- when she was 14?
F1: Yes, when she went to work in the mill.
MALCOM: Seems like she was still a little girl don't it?
F1: It sure does.
MALCOM: And doing the job of an adult.
F1: That's right. She had a family.
MALCOM: She sure was pretty and still is.
F1: Well, thank you. She's a wonderful woman.
00:22:00MALCOM: She sure is. I love her to death. She's been like a second
grandmother to me.F1: Well, bless ya'.
MALCOM: It's kind of when you think all your family's gone and all of a
sudden you've got family that you didn't even know you had and --F1: That's right.
MALCOM: That's really great. She's -- she's a very, very wonderful lady.
F1: And if there's any way in the world my mother can help you, she will help you.
MALCOM: She will. She sure will.
F1: She sure will.
MALCOM: You know, when me and my wife first got married --
F1: Uh-huh.
MALCOM: -- she told us that it -- you know, and we just went to the courthouse
and got married, she told us if we didn't come to her house the first thing we got out of the courthouse that she was gonna to skin me. She was gonna to skin me the other day but she was really serious then so that was the first place we went when we got married.F1: That sounds --
MALCOM: Was to see ma.
F1: -- just like mom. It sounds just like her. She's 81 years old.
MALCOM: Yeah, I know that and she is so spry and so alert, and, uh, I tell you,
you just can't say enough about her --F1: That's true.
MALCOM: -- 'cause she --
F1: She's a wonderful woman.
MALCOM: -- she so sweet and...
HELFAND: OK, great.
00:23:00(break in video)
JAMIE STONEY: Roll. OK, roll. Tommy?
MALCOM: Mr. Sharpe, it's a real interesting picture. Do you think you could
tell me a little bit about it?SHARPE: Yeah, about the strike?
MALCOM: The strike in the picture and what they're doing there.
SHARPE: Yeah, they -- people were deputized. You know, that's my daddy there
on the left-hand side. And they deputized him to keep the union out.MALCOM: To keep the union --
SHARPE: When they come down the row, they deputized him to keep him from going
down to the mill. So they made him stay in the row. They come in in cars. They was -- maybe a hundred or two of 'em, I didn't count 'em, you know, and they stayed in the cars and then they had people here to go out and talk to 'em, but they would not let 'em down into the Village.MALCOM: Was there, uh, groups like this at -- just every road --
SHARPE: Come to the road, yeah.
MALCOM: -- every road?
00:24:00SHARPE: Yeah, yeah. You've got it at every road, a different groups. Well,
there wasn't but one road then. See, now they got more road but then there wasn't but one road coming from Opelika, that's the way they come from.MALCOM: Yes.
SHARPE: Opelika down to there 'cause there wasn't no roads coming in from
nowhere else. So they made them stay in the road. That was in 1934 and I think it was around in September somewhere along in there.MALCOM: Yes.
SHARPE: And all -- all of us kids were down here at the filling station over
here on the right-hand side about, oh, 50 yards from there, and they made us stand down that a way with our guns.MALCOM: They had showed 'em with guns?
SHARPE: Yeah, well, I -- I, 14 you was a man then, because you made your own way.
MALCOM: Yes.
SHARPE: When you was 14 years old. Now they still young'uns, but then you's
a man see, 'cause you was raised with guns.GEORGE STONEY: Tommy, ask him about working in the mills.
SHARPE: And they come in -- I don't know how long it lasted, two or three
weeks or something like. You know, I was young. I forget how long we stayed 00:25:00there but they come in every day, you know, trying to get the union in. And, uh, they never did have no fighting, I think 'cause of too many guns there.MALCOM: How was it to work in the mills back then?
SHARPE: Oh, it was nice. I went to work in '35 down there and, uh, $7 a week.
That was good living though 'cause I had been plowing for a nickel a day.MALCOM: Nickel a day.
SHARPE: Sure had and that was a lot of money. I'm going tell ya, man, I got a
dollar then I feel like a millionaire. That's a fact. It is nice. Well, the mill, it was hot but it's good living. You had money to do about anything you wanted to, you know, just --MALCOM: How did you feel standing beside, you know, with a lot of these people
that they was trying to keep out?SHARPE: Well, ye-
MALCOM: And how did you feel about the strike and all?
SHARPE: Well, I really didn't understand it. You know, my daddy explained
things to me. See, we deputized 'cause this bunch here is trying to get our 00:26:00jobs and mess the mill up, you know, things. They had different ideas, you know, people did. So they didn't like the union back then so they kept 'em out.MALCOM: They still don't like it. They just don't let 'em and get guns no more.
SHARPE: Yeah, I guess union might be off if you got the main people over it, but
I don't know that much about the union, see. That's where my daddy was. He didn't believe in it at all --MALCOM: Yes.
SHARPE: -- because he worked for a living and whatever -- what they told him to
do, he done.MALCOM: Did your daddy work in the mill?
SHARPE: Yeah, he was a loom fixer. He was a head loom fixer then.
MALCOM: For West Point?
SHARPE: Yeah, West Point-Pepperell. Then I went to work in there before I was
old enough, and they wouldn't give me no money, they give it to my daddy.MALCOM: They paid you --
SHARPE: The envelope -- wasn't no such thing as checks. You'd get a little
envelope, a ticket with several dollars in it. I got seven every week. Then I got married in '38. I was making $9 a week. I was making good money back 00:27:00then, you know, a nickel was a nickel.MALCOM: Uh-huh.
SHARPE: And started taking Social Security out 'bout long there. But I made
it and I'm still here. I'm almost 71 years old [laughter].MALCOM: What -- what -- what was your first job in the mill? When you first --
SHARPE: Blowing off looms. Take a air hose and blow of the looms. Like they
made me do everything. I hauled quills, I stripped quills, I hauled filling, I filled the batteries.MALCOM: You filled batteries?
SHARPE: Yeah, I filled batteries. See, back then you done everything and
that's the way I learned, and I started overhauling and learnt to be a loom fixer.MALCOM: Uh-hum. Was it hard for you to move up in the mill?
SHARPE: Sir?
MALCOM: Was it hard for you to move up in the mill?
SHARPE: No, not really, just 'cause I was a hard worker. And back then if you
a hard worker, you could move up. You've got to want to work. You know, on any job that you do, you got have pride in it.MALCOM: Yes.
00:28:00SHARPE: I had pride in anything I done. If it was sweeping floor, I had pride
in sweeping. And I built on up. And I made a good living and I worked in it 35 years and had a good living.GEORGE STONEY: Tommy, I understand that later on he was a shop steward. Could
you ask him about that?SHARPE: Yeah, shop steward to the whole mill.
MALCOM: At Opelika Manufacturing?
SHARPE: Yeah, that was on up --
JAMIE STONEY: (sneeze) Excuse me.
SHARPE: -- I just (overlapping dialogue; inaudible).
MALCOM: Can you, uh, tell me a little bit, uh, how things were that finally made
the people at Opelika Manufacturing decide to join the union?SHARPE: See, I'm just talking' about Pepperell a while ago, now this is a
different mill. So when I went in service and come back, I come back to the old mill 'cause they had a better job for me. I got a standard loom to fix on in. Then they formed the union.MALCOM: Can you tell me a little bit about how things -- how bad things were
that it finally made people decide they had enough, they want a union?SHARPE: Yeah, yeah. We all did and I was in that bunch end and the union
00:29:00[master?] finally come out to the gate 'cause back -- the other time, you know, the other strike they wouldn't let 'em in there. But they come to the gate and give out papers and we all taking the papers and they come around and told all of us if we -- if we fool with the union, there's no [fash?]. Well, they did fire me for three months. Then we wanted a union that had to give me my job back and $1600 and give me a lifetime job in there. That's where your union done in -- done me. Then, but a union and it was back then, see. If you got the right man above you, union is a good thing.MALCOM: It still is if you got the right leadership.
SHARPE: If you got the right leadership, the union is the best thing for the
working people, I'll tell you right now. If you've the right people ahead of you, you'll -- they make your job easier, your money come easier, and you enjoy it better.MALCOM: And it'll give you some of -- what you said, job for life, not
necessarily job for life --SHARPE: They give you something --
MALCOM: -- but job security.
00:30:00SHARPE: -- to show 'cause they give ya -- the union gives ya something when
you come out and would quit, retire, retirement plans, see, yeah, they got all that. And see, I worked down yonder, I don't have no retirement...