(overlapping dialogue; inaudible)
(long beep)
GEORGE STONEY: OK, Tommy.
THOM MALCOLM: Mr. Sharpe, I wanted to ask you about, uh, how you felt after
union got in what -- ho-- you know, what made you decide to start getting involved? Because, you know, you told me you was a shop steward, and how you got to be a shop steward, and how you like to --WALTER SHARPE: (inaudible) Being shop steward, you know, was something like
being boss, you know? That there was a [billy buck and billy tank?] who was president, [my president?], and they made me a shop steward to take care of certain hands. Yeah, now, see, they had to talk to me in place of going to the hands, and [blessing them out?] if they done something.MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: Then I had to go and find out why they done it or how they done it, see
if it was they fault. See?MALCOLM: Mm-hmm.
SHARPE: And if somebody wanted off sick, and they wouldn't him off, well,
I'd see why he wouldn't let him off, and see, something like being a secondhand now, you know? And I remember one, and he's dead now, but he had a 00:01:00wire stuck in his lung. [Sam Monroe?]. And I got his [business with Billy?] got started from the union is, you know, by not being able to work. That's what I done too, at the shop steward, until I, you know, quit in '74.MALCOLM: Now, talk about the advantages of a union.
SHARPE: The advantages that they got -- a union has got good advantages of on
your job. If something goes wrong on your job and you can't get nothing fixed, you go to the shop steward. The shop steward investigates it, and he gets the bosses to do something about it. Safety. You know, safety.MALCOLM: Can you tell me a little bit about some of the changes you seen
immediately, or maybe a little bit down the road after the union (inaudible)?SHARPE: Yeah. Change is, uh, they take some off of you, and fix your job before
you could [run it?], if you're a good worker. Now some of them, you know, people that didn't like it because they was lazy. They wouldn't run the 00:02:00job. Them's the kind that didn't belong to a union.STONEY: Now, could you go way back there to the time when they were making that
photograph? Could you tell us why the company didn't want a union, and what they said about the union people?SHARPE: Well, the -- uh, the union people, when they first come in down there in
'34, they said that they'd, uh, send union people in there wo-- to work, and show them people how to work, you know, how to run the job. But my daddy'd been in the mill. He worked in there 62 years. He know his job, and he didn't ne-- nobody fooling with him. But back then, a union wasn't like it is now. They'd come in there, and they'd come from up north, they -- they take your jobs away from you. And that's what really -- they stuck together. And that's what my daddy told me. I just know what my daddy told me. I was a kid, you know? But he said that people come in there and take the jobs away 00:03:00from them. So they didn't want that. So they protected their own jobs. That's the only -- see, they didn't have no law back then, protection like you do now. So you had to do your own protection.STONEY: What did the people in the -- the -- your -- your bosses say about the
union back then?SHARPE: Uh, I never talked to my boss, and my daddy never discussed business
with me.MALCOLM: What did your, uh, boss say about the union when you got it in --
y'all was trying to get in at Opelika Manufacturer?SHARPE: They say a lot of things. I wouldn't want to (laughter) say what they
said. They ain't like it too much.MALCOLM: We -- we ain't -- we ain't got to cuss, but --
SHARPE: Yeah, they -- they cussed. They said bad words. I would too, but see,
I try to live for my Lord now, I can't say all them words.MALCOLM: How did -- how did it make you feel when they was saying that? Did it
-- did it scare you or intimidate you?SHARPE: No, I ain't never been scared in my life.
MALCOLM: But I mean, did it make you kind of sc-- scared that maybe you'd lose
your job?SHARPE: No.
MALCOLM: Well, you did lose your job. Guess you wasn't scared what --
SHARPE: I lost my job, but it didn't scare me. Because I know [we was to
win?], because I believe in anything that I do. If I didn't believe in it, I wouldn't have been in it.MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: I believed in the union, and I was -- and I was in it, so I knew I'd
get my job back. And I did. And, uh, I stayed in there until I come out in 00:04:00'74. I'm forgetting now what year we formed the union in there.MALCOLM: Nineteen seventy?
SHARPE: Seventy.
MALCOLM: That's what's on our charter, (overlapping dialogue; inaudible).
SHARPE: Yeah, well, that's what -- when it was. I forget the years, you know?
But I -- I believe in anything that I done, I believed in. I believed in the union then, because it done changed. And we had bad jobs in [in that end?]. We had more than we could do. And you come out of that and wring the water out of your socks.MALCOLM: Is -- is that -- did, uh, the working conditions get, uh, [pretty good,
a bit better?]?SHARPE: Yeah, they changed. You know, you see how it is now. They got air
conditioning there, you don't get nasty. Back then, you couldn't even tell what you was when you come out of that. You got some people been in there a long time.MALCOLM: I've talked to quite a few people spend there --
SHARPE: Yeah, I stayed in there 35 years. And I'd love to go through there
right now and look how modern it is, you know? Because I spent a lot of years, all my life in one. 00:05:00STONEY: OK, let's hold it just a moment. (break in video) OK, Thom.
MALCOLM: Sure. Could you, uh, tell me a little bit about some of these people
in this picture right here? Maybe it's what some of their jobs was --SHARPE: Yeah. Yeah, I --
MALCOLM: -- maybe why they -- what -- what made them decide to come up there?
SHARPE: Well, most of them, I can. Now, this is my daddy on -- on the right
over here. He was --MALCOLM: The one sq--
SHARPE: -- something like a head loom fixer then. All right, these his bosses
right here --MALCOLM: On the front line.
SHARPE: -- in the weave shop. This third one here, he was a -- he's a
personnel man. And, uh, [know working, know hire and fire the people?]. His --MALCOLM: Mm-hmm.
SHARPE: -- his name is [John Lynch?], and I can't -- now this weave shop boss,
I forget his name, but he -- he worked down for [Mr. Golden?]. Right? Now here's a -- over here were the card room boss, the fourth in there, and then you got two spinning room bosses, the fifth and the sixth one. And now, I can't remember now that that -- that last one. And he was some kind of boss up in the card room. And a picker room with some, you know? And these others 00:06:00here, they -- they just deputized --MALCOLM: Were they --
SHARPE: -- stand that, because there weren't enough of bosses.
MALCOLM: Where they workers in the mills?
SHARPE: They work in the mill, yeah, they worked in the mill. And different
crews comed up, you know? Not more of them, and --STONEY: (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)
SHARPE: -- and my daddy got one of them pictures [of that?].
STONEY: -- what they were doing with those guns?
MALCOLM: What were they -- what were they doing with the guns?
SHARPE: They was protecting -- they was there to keep the union out from coming
down the road.MALCOLM: What -- these people that worked in the mill, do you think they were
really actually willing to shoot somebody?SHARPE: Yes, they done shot them, when they come down that road. When you
protecting your family and your -- your job, see? And you ain't much of a man if you can't protect your family and your job. Because they got law, now they do, but then, they didn't have law. You had to be your own law. They didn't have but one law. And he was in Opelika.JUDITH HELFAND: Can you explain to us -- you said that -- you told me there was
only one sheriff.SHARPE: One sheriff.
HELFAND: And he was the one who deputized.
00:07:00SHARPE: Yeah, two deputies.
HELFAND: And you saw them with their arms raised, and they said something.
Could you describe what you saw, that one --SHARPE: Yeah, they -- they -- uh, see, they deputized these people. And, uh,
they raised a hand, their right hand, you know? And, uh, to uphold the law and protect, you know, the mill. And that was a -- his name was John [Moon?]. That was the sheriff. And he had a deputy named [Hold Ivans?], and another now. Now, I forget what his name was. I believe his name was Buck Johnson.MALCOLM: Did they -- uh, did they pay these people anything for being deputies?
SHARPE: No, you didn't have to pay nothing to protect your homes. And, uh,
and your job. See, they was cons-- protecting they families, really.MALCOLM: How did -- uh, what -- what them decide who make a deputy and who not
to make a deputy?SHARPE: I don't know who decide that, now. Uh, that was up to the grown
people. See, I was a kid.MALCOLM: Yes.
SHARPE: You don't discuss things with the kids like that.
00:08:00MALCOLM: Thought you might have, you know, heard them discussing the --
SHARPE: No, I didn't. You didn't have kids around when you discuss things
like that, but I know that my daddy said he was trying to protect his family and his job. And he said he's told -- he's told mama his name was Minnie, Minnie [Hasha?]. You know, she was an Indian, and her name was Minnie Hasha. He says, "Now, Minnie, I ain't much of a man if I can't protect y'all in my own and my job." So we kept them out. And we stayed down there as a backup crew, the young'uns did.STONEY: (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)
MALCOLM: When they -- uh, when they come -- when they came and seen -- seen all
y'all with guns, did they -- they didn't just turn around and go home, did they?SHARPE: No, they all stood up and down that road there and talked back and forth.
MALCOLM: Did they ever try to talk --
SHARPE: But they never did try to come down in there.
MALCOLM: Did they ever try to talk to the deputies?
SHARPE: Yeah, they -- we t-- the deputies went up there to talk to them. They
wouldn't let them, allow them on this here road there were standing on.MALCOLM: Uh-huh.
SHARPE: So they went up to the main road. It was a little dirt road. And
that's as far as they got. They wouldn't allow them to come down there and 00:09:00talk to them. So they went up and talked to them, but I don't know what they discussed or nothing about it.MALCOLM: Yeah.
SHARPE: They told them, best thing they could do is turn around and go back.
Well, I -- I don't know how long they stayed there, but they come up every day for a long time, you know?MALCOLM: Did they, uh, have picket signs? Or --
SHARPE: No, they -- they was waving their arms and a-hollering and all that, but
they -- they wasn't -- didn't have no guns. I didn't see no guns they had.MALCOLM: They had no kind of weapons? No sticks or nothing?
SHARPE: No, I didn't see if they did. They might be down there in the car,
you know? But they didn't come for violence. I don't -- yeah, so I don't know. But I didn't see no guns that they had.MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: But we had our guns. And we used them, too.
MALCOLM: I believe you.
SHARPE: Sure woulda. Because we was trying to protect our place, you know?
Because we are one big family there. Back then, it was one big family, uh, the mill is. That's the way you go, you protect one another in the mill, is the way it goes. If you got a good job, you know, and people are not next to you, 00:10:00help him, him. Working in a cotton mill, I figure it's just like one big family. If y'all work together, you get the job done, and [that is hard?].MALCOLM: That's true.
SHARPE: And if you got somebody laying down on the job, get rid of him.
MALCOLM: But if you think about it, being in a union is about the same thing,
isn't it?SHARPE: That's right. Building a union is the same way. Everybody got to
work together. You got to get the right man ahead of you, and you got a good job.MALCOLM: And you got to be a family, kind of.
SHARPE: That's right. One big family, as a union. That's what union is,
ain't it? One big family.MALCOLM: One big family.
SHARPE: That's right. That's a union. And if they all got to be in a
family, [don't who don't?] need to be in there.MALCOLM: Do you think maybe if some of these people had realized -- you know,
they -- I don't -- you really think that, uh, these union people coming down there to take their jobs?SHARPE: They was back then. Uh, that -- that's what the people had to give
the [ideas?], you know? I was a kid, like I said. But, uh, back then, the union ain't like it is now. They come down there because there's a lot of 00:11:00people up north that didn't have jobs. They was going to take them down in here, you see? And spread out, but we wouldn't let them.MALCOLM: What -- you being a kid, being so young, how did you feel standing
there with a gun? You know, how'd that make you feel?SHARPE: Well, it really d-- I don't know, because see, I was raised with a gun
in my hand.MALCOLM: But you wasn't raised with a gun in your hand to shoot people.
SHARPE: No, but I learned that after I went in the service.
MALCOLM: So I mean, how'd that make you feel?
SHARPE: No, what it --
MALCOLM: (inaudible) actually have to shoot somebody?
SHARPE: I don't know. See, I was down there at the station, like I said. But
I had to help my daddy, because I loved my daddy and my mama.MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: If I'd have had to use that gun, I'd have used it. I sure woulda.
Back then, you didn't think [long?]. You know, but you had to act, because, uh, uh, your parents then might not be like yesterday. They was hard on you, and made your mind, (inaudible) [learned to survive?].MALCOLM: They learned you to protect yourself.
SHARPE: Yeah, protect yourself and survive, because there wasn't the law to
help you back then. 00:12:00STONEY: When did you have your first gun?
MALCOLM: How old were you when you had your first --
SHARPE: I don't know, about six years old. What --
STONEY: Just -- can I have you just say that? Six years old when he got his
first gun.MALCOLM: How -- he wants you -- how old were you when you got your first gun?
SHARPE: I was about six years old when I got my .22.
MALCOLM: Twenty-two.
SHARPE: But my da-- daddy learned me not to point it at no house, no [calf?],
and says, "Don't never throw your gun up unless you gon' shoot." And say, "Wait until you see what you gon' shoot at before you throw your gun up. And never point it at nobody, and never stick it in the ground. Always learned tote right, say.STONEY: Were you ever in the National Guard?
SHARPE: And never kill nothing for the fun.
STONEY: Were you ever in the National Guard?
SHARPE: Yeah, I was in the National Guard 30 years.
STONEY: Were you ever called out on strike duty?
SHARPE: Yeah.
STONEY: Ask him about that. Tell us about that.
SHARPE: Well, there wasn't strike duty when, uh -- when they had this here
rally, were black people at Montgomery. I had to go down there, but they 00:13:00wouldn't give us no sheriff [or gun?]. I didn't go but once. What's the use of having a gun if you ain't got no shells? It's like --MALCOLM: I guess they had the guns for show, then.
SHARPE: They just for show. I don't go for that.
MALCOLM: Did you see any violence in that rally?
SHARPE: No, not too much. I saw a lot of rock throwing, such as that. But I
didn't go but one time. I told them no, I said, if you don't give me shell, I ain't going back. What's the use of having a gun? That's just like going a-hunting with no shells. How you going to kill anything? You know?STONEY: Now -- now, Thom?
SHARPE: How you going to protect yourself? (break in video) And I'm doing
something before daylight, because I'm already (inaudible).CREW: -- posterity. It's how we're going to do the credits.
SHARPE: And I take this cigarette out. I been --
(break in audio)
MALCOM: Tell me when you're ready.
CREW: Whenever you're ready, Thom.
MALCOLM: Mr. Sharp, I got, uh, some letters here back when all this, what we
been talking about was going on.SHARPE: Yeah?
MALCOLM: I'd like to tell you about a few of them, and see if you ever
remember this situation happening. This lady's name is, uh, Minnie [Culter?], 00:14:00and she's from Phoenix City, and she come up here into the West Point Pepperell Manufacturing, which is what it was called then, to get a job. And the supervisor come to the gate, and he asked her, did she believe in a union, and did she belong to the union? And she said, "Yes sir, I belong to the union." He said, "Well, we fire people at this mill for having something to do with the union, and you -- you have never worked here." And can you remember that happening?SHARPE: No, not exactly. They didn't tell me that, because I -- I know they
didn't believe in a union back then. That -- that's [when?] went to work with them in the mill.MALCOLM: Uh, yes. Well, right before you went to work. But, uh --
SHARPE: Yeah.
MALCOLM: -- maybe it didn't happen to you, but can you remember it happening
to other people? Maybe seeing somebody come to get a job, and because they was --SHARPE: No. If I went to school, working somewhere else before I went in that
mill, you know? They -- you couldn't hang around a mill. Now, my daddy might explain something to my mother, but they didn't discuss business with me. I can't remember that.MALCOLM: OK. This is a letter from a guy to President Roosevelt. He lived in
00:15:00the mill village, and he -- this was back when they started getting the unions in the mill.SHARPE: Yeah, I know him.
MALCOLM: His name was, uh --
SHARPE: I know Roosevelt.
MALCOLM: -- [Epcot?], uh, Mr. Lamar. OK. O.D. Epcot. He had -- that was the
guy's name.SHARPE: Yeah.
MALCOLM: He had a sign on his front porch in the mill house that said, uh,
"Textile Workers of America, Local 1892. For information, apply here." And, uh, Mr. Lamar Moore, which I guess was a boss at the mill --SHARPE: Yeah.
MALCOLM: -- told him to take that sign down, or he was going to have to move.
SHARPE: Yeah, I remember him.
MALCOLM: Can you --
SHARPE: [More?].
MALCOLM: Can you remember anybody having to move out of a millhouse, them, you
know, because they w-- had maybe a sign up, or --SHARPE: Yeah, (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) on account of that, yeah, they
found out they work for the union. I know several. I don't remember their names now. They found out they did work for the union, they made a move.MALCOLM: They did?
SHARPE: Yeah. I remember that.
MALCOLM: Can you, uh, tell me anything about how -- what these people did? Did
they take -- did they just go in and move? Or did they try to -- 00:16:00SHARPE: Yeah, they just went on a move. That's all they could do.
MALCOLM: They didn't try to --
SHARPE: They bar them from Pepperell. See, there, uh, that's private down in
there Pepperell mill, uh, West Point Pepperell Mills. See, that's private. It's not like the Opelika Manufacturing Company. They own that right there, then they let -- they -- there ain't nobody getting out. Not even sheriff can go down there unless they get permission. It's just like, if you own an acre of land, ain't nobody can come on there unless you give them permission. So they own it all.MALCOLM: And it's kind of like, uh, a little city in itself.
SHARPE: Yeah, that's right. It is a city in itself, and they go -- they
don't need a union, because they got all the benefits that a union's got, and more.MALCOLM: Can you remember a thing called a company store?
SHARPE: Yeah. Mm-hmm. [Jim Varner?] run it. Yeah, they used to have little
salad picture there when I was about seven years old, it's a picture show. And old Tom Mix used to play in that.MALCOLM: Did, uh -- when you went to the company store, did you find that
sometime it ended up taking a lot of your paycheck? 00:17:00SHARPE: No, they didn't take none of your paycheck. (laughter) Just [divide
it, yeah?].MALCOLM: So really, in a way, you ended up giving them back everything you made.
SHARPE: Yeah, really. Yeah, you got all -- they get the money back, because you
-- see, you rent the houses from them, 50 cents a month. All right, you had to buy wood from them, or coal. They had the coal yard and the wood yard. Pepperell owns all this, say. All right, you had to pay them for the coal, maybe a dollar a cord, or, uh, a dollar a cord, a ton for coal, see? Because you didn't have gas. And, uh, we had, uh, wood stoves and kerosene stoves when we first moved into Pepperell. Now, that's been a long time ago, you know?MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: And we didn't have no gas. We had -- we had little coal boxes behind
they built us. They got all the money back that they made off of us.MALCOLM: So you really --
SHARPE: They sent -- even the grocer bill, see, that was [Jim Varner?] run the
grocery store, and they got the post office.MALCOLM: So --
SHARPE: So they got the money back. Otherwise, you break even. You might had a
00:18:00little bit to go for the show or something like that.MALCOLM: So really, your whole life depended on this company, for your food, for
your --SHARPE: That's right, depend on the company.
MALCOLM: -- for your heat, for your house.
SHARPE: Yeah.
MALCOLM: And if you didn't --
SHARPE: Everything.
MALCOLM: -- do exactly what they wanted --
SHARPE: Well, you could go. Yeah, right then.
MALCOLM: No questions asked.
SHARPE: Where see, now, they can't do that a way, because a union is
different. The union, you know, got a say so in it now. And now people [that's pray to that in most stuff?]. Then, see, when I was young then, I didn't have no money left to buy nothing myself.MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: Even my kids, I'd buy them a little bit every -- every year, but
that's -- be about all I had, too. Maybe, uh, one of the little [toy?], and two or three oranges or something like that for Christmas. It ain't like it is now.STONEY: Move on to the next one.
MALCOLM: Here's a letter from, uh -- to the U-- US Department of Labor,
Women's Bureau. It s-- this -- I'm just going to read the bottom part, paragraph, said, "A letter from Mary L. Harris, 21 Simon Street, Opelika, Alabama." Who says Opelika?SHARPE: That's Simmons street, ain't it?
00:19:00MALCOLM: It says Simon. Probably Simmons. Says, "Opelika Pepperell Cotton
Mill has laid off colored sweepers and employed white ones. They think $9 is too much to pay a negro." Can you remember them laying off black people and hiring white people?SHARPE: No, I don't remember that. I -- I remember when they, uh, got the
black people in, they worked in the yards. You know, in the picket room, or down there where they load and unload the cartons, and then done the outside work, they had black people. But they didn't have none in the mills back then. See, none of them. None of them. They wouldn't allow blacks in the mill. They allowed them outside, and they done the yardwork, and the heavy work, you know, the heavy labor and such of that. Now, the black people done that. They cut they wood, the haul the coal.MALCOLM: Can you remember, uh, a black person trying to get a job inside the
plant, and what -- maybe what they told them? Did they just come out and say -- 00:20:00SHARPE: I don't know what you told them. They -- he -- he would stay there
but a second.MALCOLM: Did they come out and say, "Well, we just don't hire black people --"
SHARPE: Yeah, that's about what they told them. I never did hear them. But I
mean, that's about -- that sound about like what they tell them. Because I really didn't never believe in all that, didn't understand it. Now you know why I understand more, but when you're -- back when you're a kid, you don't understand why they wouldn't work black people like that. We [worked more?], you know, on the farm. He helped me farm, because he made more than me. I didn't like that. He made two hun-- $2.75, and I made a quarter. And I didn't like that a bit. (laughter)MALCOLM: This a letter form Minnie Epcot of the city of Opelika, and she's
saying that, uh, because she was in the union, that they laid her off. And, uh, can you remember anything like what --SHARPE: What year was that, now?
MALCOLM: Uh, 1933. But I mean, even after then, you've probably seen that
people didn't involve --SHARPE: Well, I was about 12, 13 years old.
MALCOLM: -- involved in the union?
SHARPE: Yeah, they didn't believe in the union at all. If -- if you -- if
they ever found out you worked a union, or -- oh, they'd -- they'd lay you 00:21:00off and -- and run you off `then. Sure would. And I know several down there. It worked for the union [before they?] come down there, they had to move after they found out they worked for the union. But Pepperell different from other people. They are -- the own the stuff, and, uh, they really don't need a union, because they got more benefits than a union ever give them, right now.MALCOLM: Do you think they mi-- do you think that might be to keep the union out
(overlapping dialogue; inaudible)?SHARPE: Yeah, that's what it's for, to keep the union out. That's right.
That's what they done [back then?].MALCOLM: Why do you think the, uh, companies might want to keep the union there?
Why -- why would they go so far as to give their employees more than a union plant just to keep it a --SHARPE: I don't know why. It's because they'd have to take some off of
the jobs, or something like that, see? I mean, that's my belief, that if -- if they had a union in there, a nice union, they'd take some off of them. Because a lot of them got more than they can handle, see?MALCOLM: So you think it might be because, uh, with a union, the people have a
00:22:00say so, and have a voice, (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)?SHARPE: No, they have a voice, they don't want that other voice in that.
MALCOLM: Do you think it might be because, uh, the owners and management don't
want nobody telling them how to run (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)?SHARPE: That's right, sharing the stuff. That's right, that's what it is.
Because Pepperell, you know, they still get a lot of the stuff they made down there. Uh, what they -- otherwise, they would run your life in there. It ain't like the old mill. The union -- you have, you got a little say-so about if you got a union. I don't know what kind of union it is now, you know? I don't know whether you belong to a union or not, but --MALCOLM: Yes, sir. I do.
SHARPE: -- but, uh, you got a little say-so if you got a union, a good union.
MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: And you can go to that shop steward, and explain to him about your job,
well, he's going to see if that -- that's fix, if it's safety, you know?MALCOLM: Well --
SHARPE: But see, Pepperell, you can't do that.
MALCOLM: When you were a shop steward, did -- uh, did it make you feel like you
had a little power?SHARPE: Well, you did have a little power. You didn't have to feel like it.
You had to feel like it to do your job, because I helped people in there that 00:23:00really help because the boss man trying to run over, because he didn't like them.MALCOLM: Did it make you feel good?
SHARPE: Made me feel good. Yeah, it sure did. And I'd do it again if I had
my life to live over.STONEY: Hold it. OK. Very good.
(break in video)
SHARPE: (inaudible) in the union.
(break in video)
STONEY: OK, and also --
HELFAND: [One thing at a time?].
STONEY: OK.
CREW: Ready.
STONEY: Uh, yes. Go ahead.
MALCOLM: Mr. Sharpe, I want to, uh, get back to when, uh, you was 14 and all
these union people come in. You ever heard the phrase, "flying squadron"?SHARPE: The what?
MALCOLM: Flying squadron.
SHARPE: No, I didn't hear about no flying squadron. Did, I done forgot it.
MALCOLM: Well, that's --
SHARPE: What, was that a union? Or...
MALCOLM: No, sir. The people that come down there --
SHARPE: Yeah.
MALCOLM: -- they were called flying squadrons --
SHARPE: Oh, yeah, they --
MALCOLM: -- because they would go from place to place.
SHARPE: Oh yeah. What -- they called them, uh, Yankees. And that's what they
called them back then.MALCOLM: Yankees?
SHARPE: Yankees.
MALCOLM: That was probably one of the [nicest?] (overlapping dialogue; inaudible).
SHARPE: But see, that's the union. That was union. So, there wasn't no
union down in the South, the union come from up north and form, because they -- 00:24:00they got more money, too. You know, they was richer up there. And they called them Yankees (inaudible), you know, back then.MALCOLM: When -- uh, when these people came, did they come in cars, did they
walk? Were they walking?SHARPE: Some of them was walking, and then they had -- [you share A models?],
you know? That was all it was back then, A model. And, uh, [old rios?], you know, had them come by the [lights on apprentice?].MALCOLM: Yes.
SHARPE: Well, you know what I'm talking about. Well, there -- there used to
be some of them, too. My daddy owned one.MALCOLM: Did any of them come on horseback?
SHARPE: Yeah, they had horses, and some of them were walking. No, they had
mules. And, uh --MALCOLM: Where did they come from?
SHARPE: They c-- they come from up towards Opelika, well, out of Georgia, I
imagine what it come. They come from pretty good wage. See, anything out of Opelika was foreigners then. They called everybody foreigners. Well, most of them said "fuh-nuhs." You know?MALCOLM: W-- when you -- when y'all seen them coming down the road, was it
exciting, or was you -- 00:25:00SHARPE: Oh, it was exciting to me. (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)
MALCOLM: Did you go up there to -- to see them? Or --
SHARPE: I was about half grown. You know, I wanted to get off a shot. (inaudible)
MALCOLM: Tell me -- tell me what you did when you seen them coming.
SHARPE: I didn't do nothing. They made us stay back where we was at. I know
not to move, because my daddy told me to stay right there. And, but I wanted to get in it, you know? Because, you know, 14, you was grown, you know?MALCOLM: Yes, sir.
SHARPE: Back then, and, uh, you want -- you want to get off a shot too to show
them what you could do. There wasn't no [extent?]. They just waving their arm, a-hollering, "We want your job, we want the union to come in here and --" there were things like that.MALCOLM: They were act-- they were actually saying "We want your jobs"?
SHARPE: Oh, yeah. They was hollering that "We want your job, we want to make
a better place to live," or things like that, you know? But i-- it quiet them down when they saw we wasn't no -- when the grown people weren't no mood, and they weren't scared of them, they quieted down. Now, there's four or five of them, went up and a-talked to them to the main road. And, uh, I don't know what they said because I couldn't hear. But there wasn't no voices 00:26:00raised, you know, then were talking. But they still holler, they was hollering every time they come down through that. And it was -- and some of them says, "Here come them foreigners," or "Here come them Yankees. Get ready for them, now." [So you?] kept your guns stacked up until they heard them coming, then they take the guns and put it in their hands.MALCOLM: They would? Did, uh -- did they -- how long did they stay, usually?
Did they stay there all day and all night? Or was --SHARPE: Wasn't all there. They stay there most of the day, but then they
left. Then they come back the next day.MALCOLM: Do you think they went all the way back home to Georgia --
SHARPE: No, I don't --
MALCOLM: -- or did they camp outside of town?
SHARPE: I wouldn't know, because, uh, we weren't allowed to go nowhere, you
know, back then. They might have went on up to Opelika somewhere, a-- and camp, then come back. But I think they went back up to LaGrange, or somewhere up in there, you know?MALCOLM: How long did, uh, this go on? Uh, like, for a month or a week?
SHARPE: Oh, I don't know. Two or three weeks, I guess. Something like that.
I don't know, I don't really know. But it come -- (inaudible) a while to me. 00:27:00MALCOLM: Can you think of something that might have happened to finally make
them quit coming?SHARPE: No, I can't. I don't know what made them.
MALCOLM: What made them stop?
SHARPE: I guess they just had to give up, because, uh, the people in Pepperrell
wouldn't give up. They was going to stay there as long as they job was in jeopardy. You know, they was [going to save?] their job somewhere or other. And, uh, that's the reason they had the guns. And, uh, but back then, you know, kids kept their mouth shut.STONEY: Good. That's nice.
HELFAND: Um, (inaudible). He went to school with (inaudible).
(break in video)
STONEY: (inaudible)
MALCOLM: Uh, do -- do you remember who took the picture? And, uh, uh, did --
STONEY: Uh, sorry, hold the picture in your hand.
MALCOLM: This pi-- and, uh, remember that, uh, would -- surely, they didn't
stand around like this all the time.SHARPE: Yeah, they was different people stood like that. And a different bunch.
MALCOLM: And did they pose for the picture, or was they just -- (overlapping
dialogue; inaudible).SHARPE: They posed for the pictures while the other people wasn't there. Uh,
00:28:00[Dad golden?]. He was a manager of the weave shop and all. He's the one that taking a picture. And where he wasn't now, they would fill out this spinning room. He's a -- he's one of these here over here. Now, he taking the pictures of that other bunch.MALCOLM: Uh-huh. How did you get the picture?
SHARPE: Might have had -- belonged to my daddy.
MALCOLM: But did they give everyone that was in this picture a picture?
SHARPE: Yeah, he give -- they give all the deputies one.
MALCOLM: And how --
SHARPE: So he was a deputy.
MALCOLM: Can you remember about how many deputies or there were all together? I
mean, I know you probably can't remember the exact number.SHARPE: Oh, I imagine there was 100 of them in all, because I had different shifts.
MALCOLM: Uh-huh.
SHARPE: Because they stayed there 24 hours a day, say, different people. My
daddy, he's, uh, stay his shift, somebody else stay they shift. They didn't (inaudible) leave.MALCOLM: Did, uh, the union, uh, people ever come at night?
SHARPE: I don't know, I wasn't allowed out after night.
MALCOLM: You never did hear?
SHARPE: Uh-huh. Kid back then, you went to bed. You didn't ramble at night.
And that kid now --STONEY: Ask -- ask him --